[Building Sakai] Scoring Agent API for review

Mon Dec 16 14:32:48 PST 2013

A couple of things to add to John's insights.

iRubric does provide LTI integration.  But, there's a little limitation on
the Sakai side that only allows LTI integration with a single gradebook item
(as of six months ago). 

Also, the user experience with LTI is not as natural as our deep
integration.  For one, an iRubric LTI would sit outside of Gradebook or
Assignment tools as a separate tool.  Users want to stay in their tool of
choice (gradebook or assignments) that they usually use for grading.  LTI is
also a bit harder for the end-user to setup. 

HTH,

Ramesh.

Ramesh Sabetiashraf
Reazon Systems, Inc.

Mailing: 5319 University Drive #111, Irvine, CA  92612
Headquarters: 1300 S. Bristol St., Santa Ana, CA 92704
Phone: 949-222-2266 x801. Fax: 949-860-2408

Creator of RCampus and iRubric
Recipient of TechAmerica High-Tech Innovation Awards

ePortfolio | LinkedIn

-----Original Message-----
From: sakai-dev-bounces at collab.sakaiproject.org
[mailto:sakai-dev-bounces at collab.sakaiproject.org] On Behalf Of John Bush
Sent: Friday, December 6, 2013 10:21 AM
To: Neal Caidin
Cc: Sakai-Dev
Subject: Re: [Building Sakai] Scoring Agent API for review

It certainly a totally valid approach.  Especially if you don't care about
your LTI tool being portable from one LMS to another.  Because then you can
call sakai webservices all over the place and do really rich integrations.
I know this isn't what LTI was intended for, but it totally viable approach
for simply building Sakai tools when you want to be free from sakai
technology choices or deployment schedule etc.

On Fri, Dec 6, 2013 at 11:01 AM, Neal Caidin <neal.caidin at apereo.org> wrote:
> It will be interesting to see if the new Karuta Portfolio system, 
> which is emerging out of the Sakai Portfolio community and which is 
> based on LTI, can evolve into something that would work. Seems like 
> that depends on many factors, way too early to tell.
>
> Thanks for the info.
>
> — Neal
>
>
>
> Neal Caidin
> Sakai Community Coordinator
> neal.caidin at apereo.org
> Skype: nealkdin
> Twitter: ncaidin
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Dec 6, 2013, at 10:38 AM, Matthew Jones <matthew at longsight.com> wrote:
>
> Yea, that's essentially right, LTI generally puts more work on the 
> provider which they may or may not be willing to do.
>
> Also at the moment I'd LTI, even at 2.0, doesn't have a an extension 
> for handling this type of use case very well. The current LTI simple 
> outcomes alone can't handle everything this is going to need to do and 
> integrate as well as we'd like. Some type of integration with these 
> tools is what's really expected.
>
> So you would need to be able (in a site in the Sakai sense) have 
> gradebook, assignment and forums be able to be available to send their 
> items to the provider and make them gradable.  There likely could be 
> extension(s) created that could eventually implement this interface as 
> part of LTI 2.0 in the future, but I agree this is the best solution for
the moment.
>
>
>
> On Fri, Dec 6, 2013 at 1:13 AM, John Bush <jbush at anisakai.com> wrote:
>>
>> More like practical constraints.  The reality is there was already 
>> iRubric integration existing, albeit it was a set of patches.  LTI 
>> would require iRubric to make changes on their side.  That is not 
>> something they are interested in doing.  From what I understand the 
>> user experience is less than ideal as well, because folks would 
>> prefer a more integrated solution into the sakai tools, then treating 
>> it as a whole separate tool which is typically the LTI experience.
>>
>> On Mon, Dec 2, 2013 at 7:54 AM, Neal Caidin <neal.caidin at apereo.org>
>> wrote:
>> > That’s very interesting.
>> >
>> > I’m guessing you considered LTI , but feel this is a better 
>> > approach? Or there are technical constraints?
>> >
>> > Just curious.
>> >
>> > Thanks,
>> > Neal
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Neal Caidin
>> > Sakai Community Coordinator
>> > neal.caidin at apereo.org
>> > Skype: nealkdin
>> > Twitter: ncaidin
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > On Nov 26, 2013, at 3:37 PM, John Bush <jbush at anisakai.com> wrote:
>> >
>> > Please check out:
>> > https://crucible.sakaiproject.org/cru/SAKTRUNK-22#details
>> >
>> > https://jira.sakaiproject.org/browse/SAK-23717
>> >
>> > I believe this is low impact work to include in Sakai 10 as its a 
>> > brand new service that doesn't really touch anything else.
>> >
>> > In order to support integrations like iRubric or other use cases 
>> > like it. We want a core API that tools can bind to in order to 
>> > integrate into their user interfaces without relying on patches or 
>> > direct third party code. This api can then be implemented by third 
>> > party providers like iRubric or others and optionally included into 
>> > sakai builds, much like we do with the content review api and turnitin.
>> >
>> > The iRubric implementation of this API, can be found here:
>> > https://source.sakaiproject.org/svn/msub/rsmart.com/sakai/trunk/iru
>> > bric
>> >
>> > mods to gradebook2 which rely on this service can be found here:
>> > https://source.sakaiproject.org/contrib/rsmart/msub/gradebook2/trun
>> > k
>> >
>> > It would be nice for Sakai 10 to have this API included so that gb2 
>> > can merge in these changes, and we could start work in other places 
>> > (like Assignments) that wish to have iRubric integration included, 
>> > post Sakai 10 release. The end game here is that Sakai might have 
>> > "hooks" for iRubric integration without needing to include iRubric 
>> > code ootb and without relying on patches that have to be constantly 
>> > maintained and applied to multiple places in the codebase.
>> >
>> > --
>> > John Bush
>> > 602-490-0470
>> >
>> > ** This message is neither private nor confidential in fact the US 
>> > government is storing it in a warehouse located in Utah for future 
>> > data mining use cases should they arise. ** 
>> > _______________________________________________
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>>
>>
>> --
>> John Bush
>> 602-490-0470
>>
>> ** This message is neither private nor confidential in fact the US 
>> government is storing it in a warehouse located in Utah for future 
>> data mining use cases should they arise. ** 
>> _______________________________________________
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>

--
John Bush
602-490-0470

** This message is neither private nor confidential in fact the US
government is storing it in a warehouse located in Utah for future data
mining use cases should they arise. **
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