[Building Sakai] Fwd: [WG: Sakai QA] [DG: User Experience] User Experience] why a separate step to join sites?

Daphne Ogle daphne at media.berkeley.edu
Mon Jul 27 12:02:09 PDT 2009 

Hi all,

Copying lists to keep our work more transparent.  I apologize if this  
doesn't make sense.  The referred to affinity diagrams will be posted  
on confluence sometime this week and I'll share a link then.


Not sure if these will end up in our "we plan to support" or "context  
informs our work" buckets but I just added a few use cases to our  
affinity diagram from last week based on this thread:

-  give colleague access to document on my site without being member  
(or joining)
-  allow me a sneak preview of site before I join
-  invite colleague to access document and join site at the same time  
(explicit ask for joining site)

We already captured general invite and join use cases.

If we decide any of these are in our scope, I think they would be good  
ones to grow into context scenarios.

-Daphne

Begin forwarded message:

> From: David Haines <dlhaines at umich.edu>
> Date: July 24, 2009 11:55:49 AM PDT
> To: Jim Eng <Jimeng at umich.edu>
> Cc: Sakai QA <sakai-qa at collab.sakaiproject.org>, sakai-dev sakai-dev  
> <sakai-dev at collab.sakaiproject.org>, Sakai UX <sakai-ux at collab.sakaiproject.org 
> >
> Subject: Re: [Building Sakai] [WG: Sakai QA] [DG: User Experience]  
> User Experience] why a separate step to join sites?
>
> RIght.  My fat fingers typed permission but I meant preference.
>
> - Dave
>
> David Haines
> CTools Developer
> Digital Media Commons
> University of Michigan
> dlhaines at umich.edu
>
>
>
>
> On Jul 24, 2009, at 1:35 PM, Jim Eng wrote:
>
>> This might be a good idea, but it seems more like a user preference  
>> than a permission.
>>
>> Jim
>>
>>
>> On Jul 24, 2009, at 11:53 AM, David Haines wrote:
>>
>>> I'm just thinking about Sakai 2 here.
>>>
>>> How about a user permission like: "Automatically join sites I  
>>> visit"?  Set to true this lets people avoid the explicit join  
>>> step.  Set to false it implies that the current behavior would be  
>>> unchanged.  If the default can be set in sakai.properties then  
>>> institutions can select their own default behavior, but  
>>> individuals can override for themselves if their needs are  
>>> different.
>>>
>>> - Dave
>>>
>>> David Haines
>>> CTools Developer
>>> Digital Media Commons
>>> University of Michigan
>>> dlhaines at umich.edu
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Jul 24, 2009, at 11:37 AM, John Norman wrote:
>>>
>>>> There is a Sakai 2 and a Sakai 3 dimension here too. In the  
>>>> scenario
>>>> mentioned by Hattie where a member of staff is going to a site  
>>>> only to
>>>> see a specific piece of content, that content will more easily be
>>>> shared with groups beyond the site membership - making "join"
>>>> unnecessary /for this use case/.
>>>>
>>>> The implications of a "joinable" site are that the owners want to
>>>> allow a wide group of people to be able to choose whether they  
>>>> become
>>>> members of a site. In this situation it is logical that they  
>>>> should be
>>>> able to visit the site without restriction (but also without a /
>>>> requirement/ to join) and then should be presented with an  
>>>> opportunity
>>>> to join once there together with some information about what
>>>> difference it would make if they join (e.g. receive site
>>>> notifications, ability to post announcements, etc.). Another nice
>>>> option might be an invitation - a bit like a Google Calendar  
>>>> meeting
>>>> invitation - that can be accepted in the invitation.
>>>>
>>>> The options for Sakai 2 are different I think, due to the way  
>>>> access
>>>> controls are linked to site membership.
>>>>
>>>> John
>>>>
>>>> On 24 Jul 2009, at 16:10, Noah Botimer wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I'd like to clarify what I think are two similar proposals here.
>>>>>
>>>>> I hear Dave suggesting implicit join on visit. I hear Adam
>>>>> suggesting that joinable mean visitable, but join remaining  
>>>>> explicit.
>>>>>
>>>>> Personally, I would favor the latter (fewer side effects). Maybe
>>>>> something in/near the tool menu (portal level)?
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>> -Noah
>>>>>
>>>>> On Jul 24, 2009, at 10:53 AM, Adam Marshall wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> I’d fully support this.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> We’ve had lots of problems with this. People cant understand why
>>>>>> there cant be a link on the “unavailable” page saying “click here
>>>>>> to join this site” – it’s a no-brainer!
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Adam
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> From: sakai-ux-bounces at collab.sakaiproject.org [mailto:sakai-ux-bounces at collab.sakaiproject.org
>>>>>> ] On Behalf Of David Haines
>>>>>> Sent: 24 July 2009 15:33
>>>>>> To: Sakai QA; Sakai UX
>>>>>> Subject: [DG: User Experience] why a separate step to join sites?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Currently if you try to access a site that you can join but have
>>>>>> not yet joined you'll get a "site unavailable" message.  Among
>>>>>> other things this makes inviting people to a site awkward.  If  
>>>>>> you
>>>>>> create a site and email a URL to people who can have access  
>>>>>> they'll
>>>>>> need to manually join before they get access.  At Michigan we're
>>>>>> running a modified version of code that Ian Boston created that
>>>>>> will automatically join people to sites they are eligible to join
>>>>>> but this requires distributing a special URL.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> But if you are trying to access a site that you have permission  
>>>>>> to
>>>>>> join what is the use of having an explicit join step?  I do see  
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> use of a tool that lists separately sites you have joined and  
>>>>>> sites
>>>>>> you can join.  I see the value of being able to unjoin sites  
>>>>>> you no
>>>>>> longer need to a member of.  I just don't see the use of  
>>>>>> requiring
>>>>>> someone to explicitly join a site.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Is there some reason that the default behavior of Sakai (2.x)
>>>>>> should not be changed to automatically join people to sites they
>>>>>> are trying to visit as long as they are eligible to join the  
>>>>>> site?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> This question comes from looking at http://jira.sakaiproject.org/browse/SAK-15832
>>>>>> .
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Any comments are welcome.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> - Dave
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> David Haines
>>>>>>
>>>>>> CTools Developer
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Digital Media Commons
>>>>>>
>>>>>> University of Michigan
>>>>>>
>>>>>> dlhaines at umich.edu
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
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Daphne Ogle
Senior Interaction Designer
University of California, Berkeley
Educational Technology Services
daphne at media.berkeley.edu
cell (925)348-4372




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