[sakai2-tcc] Status of Websphere/DB2 support for 2.8.0

Thu Mar 10 06:56:24 PST 2011

My view is that we follow past precedent with respect to unsupported code and mark the WAS project as deprecated and slated for removal in sakai-2.9.0.  I believe that only fair.  This provides both a warning to the community and an opportunity, as Noah rightly notes, for community members, be it IBM or others, to take over management of the code.

Nevertheless, the WAS project is something of a special case when compared against other deprecations/removals since it appears to have at present a zero production track record and no users.  I recommend that the TCC engage with IBM directly via the good offices of Howard Baker and discuss whether or not WAS will remain a viable option for Sakai adopters in the future.  Again, it may be better suited to contrib but I think it prudent to discuss the options with IBM first before ejecting the code from core. 

Removing the WAS module from the build is itself a trivial operation but there are scattered Websphere/DB2-related code tweeks and scripts scattered through out the code base that we should audit, deprecate and if necessary remove -- and that will take some time although I don't think a significant amount of time as has been suggested.

Cheers,

Anthony

On Mar 10, 2011, at 4:38 PM, Berg, Alan wrote:

> How about for this release follow Noah's suggestion and then unless proven otherwise cleanly remove for 2.8.1. This gives more time for reactions of support.
> 
> Must say though, option 3 feels the right way if it was simple to remove.
> 
> Alan
> 
> Alan Berg
> QA Director - The Sakai Foundation
> 
> Senior Developer / Quality Assurance
> Group Education and Research Services
> Central Computer Services
> University of Amsterdam
> 
> ________________________________________
> From: sakai2-tcc-bounces at collab.sakaiproject.org [sakai2-tcc-bounces at collab.sakaiproject.org] on behalf of Noah Botimer [botimer at umich.edu]
> Sent: 10 March 2011 15:09
> To: Jean-Francois Leveque
> Cc: sakai2-tcc Committee
> Subject: Re: [sakai2-tcc] Status of Websphere/DB2 support for 2.8.0
> 
> I think we need to use some subtlety. It may be gratifying to enforce a rule like this to show how tough and pragmatic we are, but let me suggest a different approach -- my take on pragmatism.
> 
> First, I think the code, however complete or supported, is not trapping people or causing bugs for those not using it. This softens my opinion on it.
> 
> Second, I think there is some significant amount of housekeeping to remove things cleanly and completely. This is rather different than a self-contained tool.
> 
> Given these, I suggest that the majority of the removal happen in one place: trunk/2.9. I also suggest that we make a minor change to 2.8: crash on startup/init with a nice, scary log message if either module is activated without "breaking the seal" with a property. I have to say that I think 2.7 is off limits, except maybe to implement the same log message as a warning instead of a crash.
> 
> I think this approach gives us the desired effect of showing strong disapproval of the current code state while focusing the majority of effort in one place that doesn't affect the 2.8 release schedule. At the same time, it would offer a grace period for someone to step forward (I think, with a more structured, explicit commitment), even if we are not expecting that to be forthcoming.
> 
> Thanks,
> -Noah
> 
> On Mar 10, 2011, at 8:48 AM, Jean-Francois Leveque <jean-francois.leveque at upmc.fr> wrote:
> 
>> Option 3 and also remove from 2.7.x because "IBM WebSphere support is
>> not going past 2.6.x and should probably not be used since bugs will not
>> be fixed."
>> 
>> BTW, not sure which releases of 2.6 are still supported.
>> 
>>> *From:* sakai2-tcc-bounces at collab.sakaiproject.org
>>> [mailto:sakai2-tcc-bounces at collab.sakaiproject.org] *On Behalf Of
>>> *Anthony Whyte
>>> *Sent:* Thursday, March 10, 2011 7:05 AM
>>> *To:* sakai2-tcc Committee
>>> *Subject:* [sakai2-tcc] Status of Websphere/DB2 support for 2.8.0
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Currently the DB2 conversion scripts are incomplete.  In addition, Earle
>>> Nietzel of Marist, mentioned in an email on the dev list a couple of
>>> weeks ago that "IBM WebSphere support is not going past 2.6.x and should
>>> probably not be used since bugs will not be fixed."
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> I wrote Howard Baker at IBM and requested clarification regarding IBM's
>>> current commitment regarding Sakai CLE Websphere/DB2 support.  He
>>> replied that he is "working with the higher ed strategy team within IBM
>>> to determine what our focus should be for Sakai in 2011.  I should have
>>> a better idea in about a month. At that point I will be able to give you
>>> a more definitive answer. Right now our focus is on resolving some
>>> issues with Sakai 2.7.1 and the IBM JDK/JRE."
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Unfortunately, resolution of the question will occur only after the
>>> expected release of sakai-2.8.0 on 31 March 2010.  This means that at
>>> present the sakai-2.8.0 WAS module and it's companion DB2 conversion
>>> script are unsupported.  Presently, given the state of the DB2
>>> conversion script, no one can perform a successful DB2 upgrade from
>>> 2.7.1 to 2.8.0
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> The situation is mitigated somewhat by the absence of any known Sakai
>>> CLE production instances running Websphere/DB2.  Neither John Bush nor
>>> myself are aware of any production instances.  Two weeks ago I polled
>>> both the production and dev lists regarding Websphere/DB2 production
>>> instances.  Thus far I have received no replies.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> At the same time the absence of any known production installations
>>> raises questions regarding the suitability of the WAS module as a core
>>> CLE project.  It may well make sense to move the project out of the
>>> release and re-designate it a Contrib project where it can be maintained
>>> by interested community members independent of CLE release
>>> timelines--but that is not for me to decide.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Options
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 1.  Do nothing other than state in the release notes that the WAS module
>>> and Db2 conversion scripts are unsupported and not tested.  The hope
>>> here is that support will be forthcoming in time for 2.8.1.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 2.  Consider the WAS module deprecated and state in the release notes
>>> that it will be removed as of 2.9.0 if community members are unwilling
>>> to support it.  If support materializes after 2.8.0 is released the
>>> status of WAS can be reviewed and changed.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 3.  Remove the WAS module from trunk and 2.8.x and relocate it to
>>> contrib along with Db2 conversion scripts.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Option no. 2 most closely resembles past practice but others may hold a
>>> different opinion on how the current situation should be handled.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Cheers,
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Anthony
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