[Building Sakai] NeoChat for production use?

Tue Feb 19 15:01:12 PST 2013

+1 for Portal chat. Chuck I am getting a number of smaller 2.9 instances
online, I'll get the portal chat enabled on those.

cheers,
Steve

On Wed, Feb 20, 2013 at 8:07 AM, Adrian Fish <adrian.r.fish at gmail.com>wrote:

> Some superb points there, Keli. Could you possibly JIRA the particular
> things mentioned, like disabling floating chat by site? There's a component
> for portal chat at
> https://jira.sakaiproject.org/browse/SAK/component/11412.
>
> There's yet another name for the floating chat: portal chat. Which one do
> folk prefer?
>
> Floating chat
> Portal chat
> Neo chat
>
> I'm thinking Portal chat myself ...
>
> Cheers,
> Adrian.
>
>
> On 19 February 2013 19:32, Keli Sato Amann <kamann at stanford.edu> wrote:
>
>> Hello,
>> Neochat looks like something that might be useful to people struggling
>> with a problem set who want to know if someone in their class is up at 2AM
>> working on a problem set and can help, or if the instructor wants a back
>> channel in a large lecture for questions. However, I seem to recall some
>> thread a few months back citing concern about students over-collaborating
>> (aka cheating) during timed online tests. Unlike a chat room, the
>> instructor has no visibility into what's being said and can't remove the
>> ability of students to talk to others in their class. Also, we are are in
>> the process of disabling the ability of those with a guest role to see
>> tools that show who is in the class because we are concerned about FERPA
>> (Forums and Wiki for now, and if we start using them more, Messages, Chat
>> Room, and Roster).
>>
>> These concerns, more than the fact that we have slightly more than 15,000
>> student installations, is what is going to hold us back from taking the
>> plunge. If we ever do jump in, I think we would need to do the following
>> first:
>> 1) Give instructors and admins the ability to remove the chat feature
>> selectively from particular sites (is this possible by letting instructors
>> change skin?) And possibly, to prevent chatting with My connections and/or
>> develop a tool to show whether two people are chatting (don't think we need
>> to see the content of the chat) in case there is some sort of investigation.
>> 2) Remove guests from inclusion in the chat.
>> 3) To better protect privacy by making options clear, I would suggest
>> renaming "who can see my online status" to "who can see if I'm online?" and
>> moving it above  "who can see my status" so the two are not confused. And
>> does "everyone" for online status really mean everyone or just those who
>> are in my classes and clubs? Might rename that option to "members of my
>> sites" just for "who can see my online status"
>>
>> Barring that, the two scenarios I described above could also be met by
>> the Chat Room alone. Neochat would allow students to ask questions directly
>> to the instructor without letting other students see the question and
>> neochat makes it easier to stumble upon other people who are online,
>> because you could be in another part of the site. However, it would start
>> getting harder to manage if more than 4 students ask a question, since new
>> names pop up along the bottom, so maybe chat room is better.
>>
>> So, I wonder if anyone has any *other* use cases for neochat? I could see
>> this being used more socially than anything else, so it might change the
>> nature of Sakai use on your campus, causing people to stay logged in
>> longer. I imagine that if schools wanted to experiment, they might create a
>> skin that hid the chat in all but a few pilot courses, assuming that was
>> possible. I don't think that would solve potential performance issues,
>> because that is still in the background, but it would allow them to run
>> usability tests without exposing chat to the whole class.
>>
>>
>> Keli Amann
>> User Experience Specialist
>> Academic Computing Services, Stanford University
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Charles Severance" <csev at umich.edu>
>> To: sakai-user at collab.sakaiproject.org, "sakai-dev" <
>> sakai-dev at collab.sakaiproject.org>
>> Sent: Tuesday, February 19, 2013 8:19:44 AM
>> Subject: Re: [Building Sakai] NeoChat for production use?
>>
>>
>>
>> The reason we put the chat into 2.9 with a warning was so that we would
>> avoid everyone on the super-large schools would turn it on at the same
>> time. My hope was that schools would start turning it on and monitor things
>> closely.
>>
>>
>> In terms of the "more requests" - these additional requests do not
>> increase database load and pretty much only tax the App Servers - In many
>> Sakai installations the DB is the rate limiting factor in terms of
>> performance and many schools have CPU to spare on their App servers.
>>
>>
>> So I would encourage folks at the < 15,000 student installations to start
>> using it. If no one ever starts using it - we will never figure it out.
>>
>>
>> Think of turning this on at you school as helping the rest of us. :) If
>> you encounter a problem I am sure that it will get quickly looked at and
>> fixed.
>>
>>
>> Its kind of like features like Dashboard or (earlier) SiteStats - we were
>> a little nervous initially and then folks started turning them on and we
>> improved things as we gained experience.
>>
>>
>> To sweeten the pot, I will buy a very nice dinner steak dinner in San
>> Diego for the first few schools who run this in production and report back
>> by June.
>>
>>
>> /Chuck
>>
>>
>> On Feb 19, 2013, at 5:31 AM, Adrian Fish wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> Load testing hasn't demonstrated any performance problems, although the
>> process uncovered a few bugs, which have been fixed. I'd say that
>> confluence page probably needs qualifying.
>>
>>
>> Floating chat is a really nice feature, if I say so myself, and it seems
>> a shame to denigrate it without some proper data.
>>
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Adrian.
>>
>>
>>
>> On 19 February 2013 10:50, Pablo San Roman Bengoetxea <
>> pablo.sanroman at unavarra.es > wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Hi all,
>>
>> We are interested in NeoChat but we have seen in the document of new
>> funcionalities (
>>
>> https://confluence.sakaiproject.org/display/DOC/Sakai+CLE+2.9+Release+Notes+-+What%27s+New
>> ) that it is not recommended for production, only for small scale
>> exploration. We are not sure if this state continues so we would like to
>> know if somebody is currently using NeoChat in production.
>>
>> thanks,
>> Regards.
>>
>> --
>>
>> ...........................................................
>> Pablo San Roman
>> HBGMI / CSIE | tel 8482
>>
>>
>>
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